Another Gabin update...
This is a bit belated, but I paid another visit to my new favorite neighborhood 'bar' last week (Wednesday, I think)... It was early in the evening, with a couple of friends, on our way down to pick up some Little Star Pizza...
This time (at about 9pm), there was nobody in the place, other than two bartenders/waitresses. Their english was horrible (which is not a crime, by the way), making it very difficult to get any straight answers out of either of them.
We ordered beers from their selection of about 6 different bottles. They have no beer on tap. We also received two nice baskets of roasted peanuts to go with our beers.
Then I began my onslaught of questions...
I started by asking them if the four of us could get our Karaoke on in one of the private rooms... "No," she said... The machine is broken. "Broken?" I asked... You don't have much liquor, and nobody who comes in here is ever buying drinks... so having broken karaoke machines is going to make business difficult...
She just nodded. As if she really understood what I was saying.
We asked if we could come back after dinner. If the machines would be 'fixed' by then.
She said no. Her answer, "one week, two week"...
And with that, I will return this weekend or next week... just as she told me... one week, two week....
If they are a karaoke bar, I feel like I should patronize my local businesses... even if I might scare their other customers away with my attempt at singing. Eventually they might tire of me showing up every week to see if the machines are 'fixed' yet.
Perhaps the key is to go in around/after midnight as I did the first time. There was plenty going on at that time. And there was one bartender who spoke perfect english, too...
P.S. if they can't do any karaoke for a couple of weeks, perhaps we should seriously consider having our NOPNA meeting there... They might 'need' the money that our meeting attendees would bring in by purchasing a drink or two... :-)
posted by Matt Lanning @ 11:09 PM
32 Comments:
Why would our neighborhood association want to harass businesses, or for that matter anyone? Unless he's talking about slave-labor, I think that Matt should mind his own business and stick to doing something positive. The first time NOPNA starts harassing neighborhood businesses, I will withdraw my membership.
Buying beers and bringing in new customers hardly constitutes harassment. If they're not up to anything, and as yet we have no proof other than rumors that they are, then nobody's going to give them a hard time.
Thanks, anonymous, for your contribution.
If you are not looking to contribute to your community by watching what's going on around you, what are you doing?
You're reading this blog, so you obviously care about the 'hood. I'm just wondering what goes on behind blacked-out glass in a bar that doesn't appear to be doing what they claim... Call it idle curiosity.
If they have nothing to hide, then call me a beer drinking customer who has a hidden interest in singing some karaoke.
The neighborhood association is not harrassing anyone. I am merely a member of the neighborhood and a concerned citizen. If you'll notice, I do not hold a seat on the board of NOPNA and do not write pretending to be something I'm not...
I do however put my name on my posts because I'm not afraid to speak my mind and share my feelings about the neighborhood in which I live.
Dear Sir:
You are not described well as “idly curious,” but rather a “nosey-parker.” The OED defines a nosey-parker as one “displaying inquisitive behaviour, exercising oppressive questioning.” Consider this in light your post where you say, “I began my onslaught of questions.” I’m sure you agree that your “onslaught of questions” to the bartenders/waiters probably qualifies as “oppressive questioning.”
But before you’re labeled as a nosey-parker, we should make sure the title fits. Here’ a link to the “nosey test” http://www.queendom.com/tests/minitests/fx/nosy.html
Also, I’ve posted some of the history on the nosey-parker below.
Finally, I certainty don’t want to be presumptuous, so you may feel better being referred to as Yenta (i.e., A person, especially a woman, who is meddlesome or gossipy.) rather than nosey-parker. It’s your call.
Anonymous
Nosey parker - prying person
Nosey has a long history as a nickname for a person with a prominent nose and as an informal adjective applied to an inquisitive person who pokes their nose into other people's business in order to get a closer look at it. Parker seems to have been added in the 1900s with the appearance of a character on a comic postcard who was named Nosey Parker. Perhaps Parker was chosen arbitrarily as the character's surname, or perhaps it comes from the dialect word 'pawk' (be inquisitive) or from parker, an old word for park-keeper, a person better placed than most for spying on what people get up to.
...The traditional explanation that the name originated with Matthew Parker, Archbishop of Canterbury in Queen Elizabeth I's day and a zealous inquisitor, fails to take into account that there is no record of the term either in his lifetime or during more than 300 years following his death.
Personally, I think Matt is taking a perfect tack, to press them into exposing what they truly do, or to step up and do what they say they do.
and, it's funny.
If I felt like I was doing something that went against the spirit of the community, I might hide behind an anonymous post. If you have something to say, put your name on it. Take some responsibility for your actions. That's all I'm asking our friendly neighborhood bar to do, and that's all I ask of anyone. If you have nothing to hide, then you won't mind sharing your identity or owning up to what you're really up to, whether your a blog poster or a bar owner.
Matt, I support your investigations of Gabin, and I don't consider it harassment.
The police acknowledge that this business is a brothel but do not seem to have the manpower to actually collect the evidence and take action (hope I'm not giving anything away there...).
Sorry, I agree with anonymous. If this business isn't harming the neighborhood, why are you harassing them? No one is being forced into these "kareoke" booths. Most citizens of SF don't get their panties in a wad over consensual sexual behavior. Are going to start harrassing the sex clubs next? Please leave them alone.
Matt,
I would expect you, as a nosey-parker, to hostilely request the identity of our friendly, albeit shy, anonymous posters. Consistent with the OED’s definition (see previous post), you are “displaying inquisitive behavior” regarding their identities and exercising “oppressive” questioning. Notice that only you, the nosey-parker, are asking for the identities of the anonymous posters. In short, NOPNA represents the community and you should respect its decision to have an anonymous post option, irrespective of you nosey-parkishness.
Regarding you nosey-parkery into Gabin, how does it benefit the neighborhood? Indeed, I would ask those encouraging Matt the same question and to specify how his nosey-parkering furthers NOPNA’s mission.
Anonymous
Go, Matt!
Go, Matt!
Dear Anonymous,
Perhaps you would like to start a campaign against the other harassment techniques that NOPNA uses in our community:
1. 'harrassing' the Emerald Fund into building a neighborhood-friendly development at Fulton/Masonic
2. 'harrassing' the police into shutting down known drug-dealing houses and meth labs
3. 'harassing' building owners who leave graffitti on their buildings or trash on their sidewalks, or worse yet, sending a block captain out to clean up the streets themselves (oh, the NERVE!)
4. littering the front steps of each house in the neighborhood with bi-monthly newsletters that educate and inform the residents
5. 'harrassing' the police into paying more attention around our 'hood and keeping track of crime statistics
6. 'harrassing' the local businesses by holding bi-monthly meetings
You're right. These people are just plain rude. How dare they pay attention to what's going on around them and dare to ask questions. How dare they ask others to be involved...
Perhaps you'd much rather live in a 'hear no evil, see no evil' society, but not me.
This is not NIMBY-ism, either. In fact, it's far from it. This is just asking questions, and looking for answers. These are the things that communities have always done. It's what makes them communities.
This is my last defense of this subject. I have made my point, and I will continue to ask questions and search for answers on things that don't make sense to me all over town. And forgive me if that offends you.
Dear Matt:
You have conveniently avoided the question of how your nosey-parkery benefits the neighborhood. The fact is that it doesn’t. Yet, you have taken it upon yourself to investigate a business and harass it through asking NOPNA to hold a general meeting there. Fortunately, I doubt NOPNA will harass Gabin as you desire.
But don’t take my word for it. Reveal your reasons for wishing to harass Gabin and let NOPNA deside. Since no neighbors have complained and the police are aware of the business, you must have some unstated moral objection. State your objection without the bullshit and be done with it. My advice: Leave Gabin alone and use your nosey-parkery for more noble goals.
Sincerely, Anonymous
One more thought. It seem strange to me that Matt is fighting the diversity and sex-positiveness that makes SF a unique and desirable place to live. One of the reasons that our city is so desirable is its proud un-puritanical heritage... from the brothels of the Barbary Coast to the sex-positive forces of the Summer of Love and Queer communitiy. It seems ironic to me that the things that have helped SF earn its reputation as heaven on earth and allow Matt to make a very good living as a realtor in SF are now under attack by him. Maybe he would be more comfortable being a realtor in Provo, or somewhere else where sex-negativism is the rule.
Or if he can't make enough money out there, maybe he could try Danville, but please don't try to transform our wonderful city into Pleasantville.
A-fucking-MEN!
Get that bible-thumping, judgmental, arrogant, white-men-knows-best, mentality the fuck out of SF.
A brothel? I always wondered about that place. I didn't realize those were still around;)
Personally, I think that what Matt is doing is noble and fine. It's falls under "community policing" or "respecting the neighborhood". I think more of the neighbors should know what's going on with local businesses, both good and bad. That is the point of the community blog, is it not?
I agree with tb.
And that last post of Matt's was just silly. Way beside the point.
Dear 2Dogs and a Baby,
Matt was trying to get NOPNA to harass the business by holding a general meeting there. That's more than just more that just, "knowing what's going on."
Indeed, snooping around to find out what's "going on" leads to action. Tys himself implied he wanted Gabin stopped when he said "women were victims."
Thus, it's not just snooping or "nosey-parkering" and NOPNA should not support it. And that shouldn't be the purpose of the blog.
I wish people who wanted to snoop, judge and condemn would go to fucking Provo as another post recommended.
The police have told me that they know this place is a brothel.
Leela,
Yes, Matt's been trying to tell you that from the beginning. Matt wrote that he went to Gabin and gave an "onslaught of questions" to the waitresses with "horrible" English. My guess is that Matt’s Korean is far worse than their English.
He doesn't give a fuck about the employees of Gabin. He's not trying to help them, and he belittles and condescends to them. He wants NOPNA to further harass Gabin by holding its general meeting there. This shit won’t be funny if jobs are lost and people displaced.
Look, you can be sex-positive and non-judgmental about sex workers and the like, and still not want Fulton & Masonic to be Sixth & Market. If Matt's poking around encourages them to keep a low profile, then he's doing something good for the neighborhood. Because regardless of how you feel about brothels in the abstract, having them in the middle of residential neighborhoods is not exactly optimal.
So far, it seems like they're going out of their way to be discrete, and there seems to be little street crime associated with the place. All fine and good. If they know the neighbors have their eyes peeled, it's likely to stay that way.
Of the people cheering Matt on, who is not judgmental? Surely not Tys who thinks women are victims. In fact, they all seem judgmental. and they're certainly not taking your position.
Matt was not just "poking around" as he wanted NOPNA to hold its general meeting there.
And they don't need Matt's continued harassment to keep a low profile. Come the fuck on.
Anonymous-
I realize you are very upset about this discussion but as a courtesy and gesture of respect, I would appreciate if you can refrain from swearing on the site.
Leela,
I'm not upset. I just like to swear.
But good golly, do we really have to stick to arbitrary rules when they're totally besides the gosh darn point? It's unbe-fussin'-lievable that you'd focus on this rather than the issue.
Hey, you there, who isn't willing to show yourself and be recognized by the community of participants on this blog,
Three things you need to learn:
1. This is a discussion board run by and for the neighborhood. On one hand, the people posting here do not speak for the community as a whole, but on the other hand, this is an extension of our public meetings and discussions, and appropriate language and respect need to be used. At community meetings, one isn't allowed 'pot shots', foul language, or anonymous statements. You should behave on this board as though we know who you are and where you live, as we do in neighborhood meetings.
2. As much as poster tb and happyinnopa enjoy the 'diversity' brought into the neighborhood by sexual prostitution, one would have to be a pretty petty libertarian to think that prostitution is a tvictimless crime.
Do you figure that these young women are in some sort of liberated-self-actualizing-sex-industry-co-op and choose this line of work? The fact that they aren't originally from this country is practically proof that they are in some sort of forced situation. Stop pulling the rainbow wool over your eyes. Interestingly, your first post got it right: "...unless he's talking about slave-labor..." That's exactly what it is.
3. Matt wanted NOPNA to have a meeting there? don't you get a joke?
4. when posts get biligerant, the operators of this blog can and will delete them.
Tys,
Okay, dad. I’ll try not to offend your tender sensibilities. But there are a few anonymous posters, not just one. I'm sure you know the IP addresses and have tried to figure it out.
Regarding your belief that all prostitutes are victims, many are independent and sell their services voluntarily. Are these women victims?
If the women of Gabin are being forced, the police should shut it down, period. But your statement that the women are not from this country is proof that they are being forced is fallacious as the dickens. I know a woman who works at a massage parlor in town who is using the money to pay for her education at SF State, sends money back to Viet Nam and only works weekends. Moreover, she has indicated that all the workers are her place are in the same boat (pardon the pun). Only someone with a special type of moral superiority and arrogance would argue that these women are victims.
The fact is you want to stop prostitution in general and will make any claim you can to do so--based on pure speculation, you call women “victims” or say they are “forced,” . Like Matt, you could give a gosh-darn if the women involved are injured. AI moved to SF to get away from this sort of baseless moral superiority and religious arrogance.
And I didn't take Matt's harassment as a joke. Sorry.
So, anonymous-(the-defender-of-prostitution-anonymous that is, you know one woman who sells her body and is comfortable with that arrangement, so prostitution is ok?
Even if you could somehow prove that 1% of prostitutes are totally in it for the fun, big money and adventure (which I doubt), that doesn't justify ANY person being trapped into having sex against their will.
about 'proof' of victimization and being from another country, I'm not saying that it's full on proof, but just a lot more probable. I think I can safely say that my generalization about many foriegn workers are being exploited, therefore these foriegn workers are probably exploited is more honest than your generalization that a few prostitutes are in it willingly therefore all prostitutes are in it willingly.
Do I want to stop all prostitution? (and will I say anything to do it? -- as you so generously call me a liar) actually, it's not something that's high on my agenda, as I don't have a lot of power to do much about it. But your preposterous statements and positions were driving me to say something, and if we are going to stop it, the communities where it happens have to start complaining.
Tys,
So you're saying that if you had the power, you'd stop all prositution. This is why I said you're against prositution in general and finding different arguments to stop it. I don't really think that's calling you a "liar." Sex is a difficult issue, so maybe you just don't understand yourself well enough to know where you stand.
So here is my question: Are you for legalizing & regulating prostitution? In The Netherlands, women choose to sell their services and all providers have work permits, health checks, etc. The services are provided in a safe, clean environment. Legalizing prositution empowers women. Don't you agree?
Sincerely, Anonymous
PS As for your other comments, they make no sense to me. Yes, foreign workers are exploited, but they come to America for better jobs. The recent protests show don't want to be sent back home. This situation is unfortunate, but not limited to prostitution.
My opinion about this is this. If the frequenters of
Gabin want a brothel, or, if you will, a happy sex-positive good-time club. Fine. In their neighborhood. I really don't want it in mine. Call
me meow-meow-meow-nosey-parker-meow. I don't care. I would prefer a neighborhood shop with
less impact on parking. Maybe a pizza place - a place to bring my family. I'm just selfish. Heck, I want a pony!
I enjoy this neighborhood - I frequent its stores - go to its parks. I think of it as being part of a Neighborhood Association.
Dear Anonymous,
You summed your position up nicely. You're "just selfish" and you think that's "being part of a Neighborhood Association."
More mindless drivel by people who care only about themselves. At least you admit it.
Sincerely,
Anonymous
PS Your name is very unoriginal.
Stop judging; they'll burn in the lakes of fire for all eternity anyways.
Jesus wins.
Jesus wins?!!
Matt, I thought you said you were finished posting on this thread!
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